Maverick Philosopher

Nihil philosophicum a me alienum puto

To promote independent thought about ultimates. Philosophy, commentary on the passing scene, and whatever else turns my crank. Since 4 May 2004. By William F. Vallicella, Ph.D., Gold Canyon, Arizona, USA. Motto: "Study everything, join nothing." (Paul Brunton) Latin Motto: Omnia mea mecum porto. Turkish motto: Yol bilen kervana katilmaz. (He who knows the road does not join the caravan.) All material copyrighted.

Of Monkeys and Minds and Identity Through Time

Malcolm Pollack quotes, with apparent approval, the Buddha:

Just as a monkey roaming through the forest grabs hold of one branch, lets that go and grabs another, then lets that go and grabs still another, so too that which is called ‘mind’ and ‘mentality’ and ‘consciousness’ arises as one thing and ceases as another by day and by night. (Connected Discourses of the Buddha, p. 595)

But why is that passage more worthy of our credence than the following utterance of the Sage of the Superstitions:

Just as a monkey roaming through the forest grabs hold of one branch, lets that go and grabs another, then lets that go and grabs still another, all the while remaining numerically one and the same monkey, despite changes of posture and position, so too that which is called 'mind,' O monks, remains numerically one and the same mind through the manifold of mental change.

Related Posts (on one page):

  1. Can the Chariot Take Us to the Land of No Self?
  2. Of Monkeys and Minds and Identity Through Time
Posted by William F. Vallicella on Tuesday December 27, 2005 at 11:06am
Malcolm Pollack (mail) (www):
The anonymous sage puts his finger on an important question. Are we one "I", or are we many? Are we perhaps blind to our own inner fragmentation?

Worthy of a new post, which shall be forthcoming.
12.27.2005 11:18am
Don Blow, Jr.:
Also interesting would be, if it is argued that we are indeed internally fragmented or not just a single "I", then why it seems as though we are, and why there is a break between that which seems to be just one "I" (but is really fragmented) and that which seems to be another single "I".
12.27.2005 8:10pm
Robert Kost (mail) (www):
It is interesting that Malcolm's quote is from the "Connected Discourses" -- connected by what?

Would the Buddha allow for separate "grabs" (acts of consciousness) without a being that grabs (the monkey, the "I"). It is easy enough to see how the former are fragmentary and fleeting, but not how there can be thoughts without a thinker or that the thinker IS the thoughts. "Unity of apperception' and all that ....

r
12.28.2005 5:59am
Bob Koepp (mail):
Robert Kost is on the mark with his reference to the unity of apperception. The fragmentary nature of conscious experience has long been recognized by western philosophy. Even if, in the end, the assemblage of fragments into a unity, is a mere facon de parleur, we should like to hear a convincing story about how we weave the web of illusion. When it comes to unweaving the web, that story will be much more useful than simply being told that our seeming unity is illusory.
12.28.2005 6:24am
Malcolm Pollack (mail) (www):
There is much more to be said here. Perhaps a useful metaphor might be that of one car with many drivers.
12.28.2005 8:46am
Bill Vallicella (mail) (www):
Yes, the unity of apperception is the issue here. I will post a short paper that tries to argue that the self cannot be a bundle of discrete data.

Bob: Isn't the phrase facon de parler (with appropriate diacritical mark)?
12.28.2005 2:20pm
Bob Koepp (mail):
parleur? oops
12.28.2005 7:16pm
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